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TheSolarSailor
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I am a Galactor.
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In episode 20, Who is Leader X?, Dr. Henjinman has created an incredible cyborg technology that Galactor wants. Leader X cites the fact that Galactor has failed in their attempts to create cyborgs. Dr. Henjinman is able to see through Leader X and know exactly what he is...a living machine of sort. Of course, the good doctor underestimated Leader X's abilities, as he was not so confined to his quarters as he thought.
Anyhow, as I have been reviewing the series again, I have noticed that other cyborgs appeared since then, created by Galactor. In Episode 27, Galactor's Witch racer , leader X refers to Lucy as one of their greatest and most precious creations. Later in Episode 29, Gallack X The Demon Man, the amazing wrestler is a cyborg. Again in Episode 43, A Romance Destroyed by Evil, two human beings are transformed into cyborgs by the episodes end.
Do you think that Galactor's cyborg technology was all based on the work of Dr. Henjinman, the old man who initially created the cyborg horses? I had never really paid attention to this before until now, seeing that I am watching the episodes through. Has anyone else ever given this any thought before??
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13-05-2011 09:16
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lborgia88
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I think it could well be that the word "cyborg" did get used in some instances where "robot" (all non-organic) might have been the more accurate term.
I found a post by Tatsunokofan, where he points out that the Gatch writers, when planning Joe's transformation for Gatch II, switched back and forth in their notes between referring to him as an "android" and as a "cyborg." Maybe they weren't always as careful as they could have been about what terms they used...
http://www.gatchamania.net/thread.php?th...704&sid=&page=2
| quote: | Originally posted by tatsunokofan
Hi all!
| quote: | | James, when was Joe then changed from an android, as your post above suggests, to a cyborg, the term used the series? |
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This change was done somewhere between the first draft of the series Planning and a revision for that Planning. I've got a trio of documents that show this progression.
The first is the hand-written copy of the first draft, where Joe is listed as an android.
The second is an hand-written addendum to the first draft, which included a list of changes that occured to the first draft (Such as name changes like Dr. Einstein to Dr. Raphael and Sadomadonna to Gel Sadra, and that Joe is now a cyborg, not an android).
The third is a final, printed version of the Planning, which incorporates the changes and additions from the addendum into the first draft. Strangely, there are a few spots in the final version where they forget to make the change from referring to Joe as an android to a cyborg, so he switches from one to the other partway through!
| quote: | | In I the term cyborg has been misused in In I the term cyborg has been misused to apply to androids and robots that have the appearance of humans or animals but in reality are not. |
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You are correct, there have been times in Gatchaman when the term cyborg has been used for what are likely androids.
| quote: | | However, I read somewhere, not sure if it was here or Wendy's site, that the cyborg Joe in II and F was supposed to be based on or inspired by The Six Million Dollar Man, who was a true cyborg though I don't recall the term ever being used to represent him or the Bionic Woman or Max. |
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I know the term was used to describe them every so often, but Universal tended to stick with the trademarkable term "Bionic" instead. Don't forget, the first Six Million Dollar Man TV movie was based off of a novel by Martin Caidin named "Cyborg."
Anyway, whether Joe was inspired by either of the Bionic duo is a debatable point. Both series were immensely popular here, but were nowhere near as popular in Japan. Six Million Dollar Man aired between 1974 and 1974 in Japan, and the Bionic Woman did the same betwen 1977 and 1978, so it is possible that they did have some influence. However, I've never found any material, vintage or otherwise, that has compared Joe to Steve Austin or Jaime Sommers. So, we really don't know for certain that they provided any inspiration.
James |
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| quote: | Originally posted by amethyst
A true cyborg is a combination of cybernetic and organic material:
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Ryu's explanation to Jinpei of what a cyborg is in ep 21 is simpler, but I guess basically accurate -the early cyborgs that we see -the horses, Lucy, Gallack X, Julia & Romina etc. all seem to have all-mechanical bodies, though perhaps with an organic veneer for disguise, but it seems they could still have their normal brains.
In Joe's case though, in Gatch II, I don't think Ryu's explanation would hold up -it seems there like Joe is still largely organic -body and brain- though enhanced and reinforced with mechanical stuff.
This post has been edited 3 time(s), it was last edited by lborgia88 on 13-05-2011 at 21:36.
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13-05-2011 21:34
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TheSolarSailor
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| quote: | | In Gatchaman II, Dr. Raphael was supposed to have been working on cyborg technology for Galactor for many years. It's entirely possible that he was doing so (and created Lucy, among others) and that Katse and X merely lied to Henjiman (Galactor lying? What a shocker!) to get him to cooperate. |
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Transmute Jun, I sure do wish I could see Gatchaman II!!! I have read all about it, but I have only seen the last three or four episodes on a VHS with fan subtitles. Anyhow, Dr. Raphael surely does figure into this subject. I forgot to mention him when I was making the thread. I wonder if Raphael was working for Galactor all along, but Henjiman provided the certain something that enabled greater creations to come along, creations such as Lucy. Do you think it possible that Lucy had only become a cyborg as of recent (after the events of Episode 20), much like what we saw happen to Romina and Julia in A Romance destroyed by Evil? Leader X says in Episode 20 that they have failed in cyborg technology thus far, but maybe after getting a hold of Henjiman's work, they succeeded? Then again, maybe X was lying the whole time.
| quote: | | A true cyborg is a combination of cybernetic and organic material: think Six Million Dollar Man, Joe in the second series or the couple from Romance Destroyed by Evil. Henjinman's horses and Gallack X are closer to robots |
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amethyst, I understand the issue of the term "cyborg" being possibly misused at times, but I keep coming back to Dr. Henjiman being abducted by Galactor. Why? Galactor did not seem to being having any trouble at all with their robotics at this point in the series, so the horses he created must have offered something more that could be of use to Galactor. The organization already possess the skills for robotics, so if the horses were just robots, then what was so special about the Dr. Henjiman and his research to begin with? They may not have shown a more cyborg visual for the horses, but I cannot help but think that there was more to them than just nuts and bolts.
Iborgia88, thank you for reposting that very interesting material that James had written.
| quote: | | Ryu's explanation to Jinpei of what a cyborg is in ep 21 is simpler, but I guess basically accurate -the early cyborgs that we see -the horses, Lucy, Gallack X, Julia & Romina etc. all seem to have all-mechanical bodies, though perhaps with an organic veneer for disguise, but it seems they could still have their normal brains. |
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This goes along with my line of thinking that there was more to Henjiman's work than meets the eye.
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14-05-2011 14:30
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lborgia88
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| quote: | Originally posted by TheSolarSailor
I wonder if Raphael was working for Galactor all along, but Henjiman provided the certain something that enabled greater creations to come along, creations such as Lucy. |
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That's a good way to reconcile both Leader X's statement in ep 21, that Galactor hasn't been successful with cyborgs, with their subsequent "successes" (Lucy, Gallack X, Julia & Romina etc.) and also Gatch II's claim that Dr. Raphael has been working with cyborgs for many years.
Then again, Leader X lying to Dr. Henjiman is certainly in character!
Heck, maybe Dr. Raphael, up to that point, had been lying -for reasons of his own- to Katse and Leader X, claiming that he was still unable to make successful cyborgs, when really he could.
I can't recall if there's any canon for exactly when Dr. Raphael left Galactor. He might have been taking advantage of Galactor's resources to secretly develop and perfect his cyborg technology, all the while telling Katse and Leader X that he wasn't having any luck. Maybe Dr. Raphael fled Galactor shortly after episode 21 though, and subsequent cyborgs (Lucy, Gallack X, Julia and Romina etc.) were based on Dr. Henjiman's work more than his own.
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14-05-2011 15:14
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