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--- Gatchaman Ebay finds! (http://www.gatchamania.net/threadid.php?threadid=2551)
Posted by Ebonyswanne on 05-06-2009 at 00:46:
Gatchaman Ebay finds!
Hi everyone,
I have a few finds to share with anyone who's interested.
One of them is original film strips! (They're out of Japan.)
A good seller there is Akkie. He's in Japan. I found him to be reasonable in prices and very good with things like postage and communication.
The cell is from Gatchaman II, there are more if you scroll down. Tats! I thought you might want to check it out. 
Anyway just for anyone who wants to know about some buys in Ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/C4752-ANIME-CEL-ScienceNinjaTeam-Gatchaman-b-TATSUNOKO_W0QQitemZ300319798679QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item45ec747597&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A0|293%3A1|294%3A50
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Every child is an artist. The problem is how to remain an artist once we grow up- Pablo Picasso.
Posted by lborgia88 on 05-06-2009 at 04:05:
These are neat!
In the second one, though, I wonder why Ken's visor isn't shaded blue.
Posted by gatchgirl on 05-06-2009 at 10:47:
Maybe he used the windex finally LB... or better yet, vinegar and or coke.... since I've been told they work better then windex.
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Posted by gatchgirl on 05-06-2009 at 10:48:
Great find Ebony..... thanks so much for sharing with us.
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" No gratitude needs to be voiced, your mind speaks to us!"
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Posted by Ebonyswanne on 05-06-2009 at 10:51:
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Its another blooper!!! see what they do when they're stilled!
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Every child is an artist. The problem is how to remain an artist once we grow up- Pablo Picasso.
Posted by clouddancer on 05-06-2009 at 11:22:
Perhaps a blooper, or I suspect it maybe that colour because of what ever the background. If Ken were in a dark place then the artist may want us to be able to see through the visor to see his face.
If I am correct that is only the overlay of a cell. That picture would probably be placed on a different background. I am wondering if a sword would be placed inKen's hand at that time as well. (I am sure James will correct me if I am wrong about that first idea, and maybe the second as well.)
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Posted by tatsunokofan on 05-06-2009 at 15:47:
Hi all!
Thank you for pointing those out. I had spotted them earlier, but I do appreciate the heads up.
As for the cels themselves, they are either publicity or mass market cels, not actually production cels. I say this because I actually own duplicates of both of those cels. Like those in the auction, the cels possess neither peg holes nor cut numbers along the top.
Regardless, for the price the seller is asking, they're nice enough images that they'd be worth getting, if anyone else wants to bid on them. Like I said, I already have them, so I won't be going after them myself.
By the way, the two Gel Sadra cels that the same seller has look to be production cels, and both are likely from the same scene, though I don't recognize the shot off the top of my head. Still, if you're looking for a couple of Gel Sadra cels for a good price, now's your chance!
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If this had been a production cel, you could very well have been correct, as they do change the visor colors to reflect the lighting in the scenes. In this partiular instance, though, it was either a sloppy decision or a cost-cutting/time-saving move when they were mass producing the cel.
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That's correct, that image is not placed against a background. Even with production cels, if they come with a background, it is infrequent that you'll find them with the proper background. Don't forget, for every shot you see, there could be dozens of cels, but there is only one background. So, you'll often find cels that have been placed against a variety of random, non-matching backgrounds that came from shots of things like hands or running feet, whose cels would likely be unsellable.
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By looking at Ken's belt, you'll notice that the holster on the right side of the belt is from Gatchaman II, so the Gatchaman Fencer would not have come into play. Had it been a publicity cel from Gatchaman Fighter, and had they wished to include the Gatchaman Fencer in the shot, it would have been drawn into the image from the start, which is how it is in the Gatchaman Fighter production cels I have. In the production of the show, the only reason they would have put the Gatchaman Fencer on separate cels would have been if the Gatchaman Fencer was moving, but Ken was not, allowing them to animate the weapon without having to redraw Ken in each cel.
James
Posted by clouddancer on 05-06-2009 at 23:04:
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Thank you for all that information James. You must have a really spectacular collection. Maybe the next time I am out your way visiting TJ I can make a visit to you as well to get a glimpse of some of your "stuff."
I do not know Gatch Fighter or Gatch II well enough to be able to tell the difference, as of yet. If I were to be honest, in my mind they are the same show,*** thus my mistake in thinking Ken could be carrying a sword.
***Although I do know there are differences when I think about it, I tend to clump them together as "not" the Gatch I know. I know, bad me, but I am still trying to figure out the differences between Gatch I and BOTP, given time and I may be able to work in another series as well.
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Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.
Posted by tatsunokofan on 06-06-2009 at 00:01:
Hi all!
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I'll just have to randomly grab a few boxes and let you two dig through them. That could easily fill a few hours!
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I became acutely aware of things like the holsters on their belts when I started trying to identify exactly which series the random cels I found for sale were from. With the holsters being different in all three series, they're a good marker. Ken and Jinpei's visors are another good thing to look for, since they were different colors in the first series than they were for the second and third series. Of course, nothing beats simply recognizing the cel, but you can't always be that lucky!
James
Posted by clouddancer on 06-06-2009 at 00:37:
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Well if you are GRABBING random boxes I might just decide to grab them and run off with them. I wonder if I could convince the Condor to make himself available on the day I go to visit you ... just to keep me covered during my escape. Of course I might have to be careful, Barrdwing might abscond with him while I was looking through your collection.
__________________
Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.
Posted by tatsunokofan on 06-06-2009 at 01:04:
Hi all!
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Looking through and enjoying things is okay. "Borrowing" without asking is not. Tsk, tsk, and here you are, a role model for children...
James
Posted by Ebonyswanne on 06-06-2009 at 12:23:
Opppsss I should have thought about that before I posted the piccies, I was a bit excited....but then he might have got some bids out of it.
Oh 
I should read the rest of the posts before jumping to conclusions...
__________________
Every child is an artist. The problem is how to remain an artist once we grow up- Pablo Picasso.
Posted by gatchgirl on 06-06-2009 at 16:00:
[quote]Originally posted by tatsunokofan
Hi all!
As for the cels themselves, they are either publicity or mass market cels, not actually production cels. I say this because I actually own duplicates of both of those cels. Like those in the auction, the cels possess neither peg holes nor cut numbers along the top.
[QUOTE]
That's correct, that image is not placed against a background. Even with production cels, if they come with a background, it is infrequent that you'll find them with the proper background. Don't forget, for every shot you see, there could be dozens of cels, but there is only one background. So, you'll often find cels that have been placed against a variety of random, non-matching backgrounds that came from shots of things like hands or running feet, whose cels would likely be unsellable.
[QUOTE]
James, so if a film strip has the holes along with a 4 digit number on one end, would that make it an original? There is also a 74-AJ and the words Fuji color N6 on the other side of the strip.
__________________
" No gratitude needs to be voiced, your mind speaks to us!"
Racer by day, Feather Thrower all the time!
Posted by tatsunokofan on 06-06-2009 at 16:34:
Hi all!
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A film strip is a completely different animal than a cel. A cel being part of the production process that goes into making an animated production (Specifically an individual piece of artwork on a transparent piece of cel luloid (Hence the abbreviation "cel") that, when viewed in a sequence with a number of other pieces of art that have a similar image showing the subject in a slightly different pose from the others, gives the illusion of movement) and the film strip being the end result of that production (When the various cels are placed against a background and photographed in sequence onto motion picture film, resulting in a strip of film that, when projected, becomes an animated movie).
A film strip has holes so it can run through the sprockets of a film projector, while a cel has peg holes to make certain all the cels in a sequence are properly aligned when they are photographed in order to make the animation smooth. The numbers and other printed material along the edges of a film strip provide information such as the film's manufacturer, model number, and batch number, while the numbers on a cel designate which specific shot in a film the cel is from, and which spot in the sequence for that shot the cel belongs.
I hope this helps!
James
Posted by clouddancer on 06-06-2009 at 19:14:
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But of course it is ALWAYS do what I SAY not what I do.
After all that is why I end up sitting on desks in class while telling my students not to do it.
Of course if I got hurt then that is my own stupid mistake, but if they got hurt falling off the desk I am the one to blame (even though they did it after me telling them not to) That is the problem with kids they never listen, they always have to do the opposite of what an adult tells them. *sorry Rant over*
__________________
Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.
Posted by Hinotori on 06-06-2009 at 20:55:
James, your knowledge never ceases to amaze me!Thanks for all the great info on the different Gatch version cels (holster types for identification) and the detailed explaination between cels and film strip frames.
I would love to get my hands on a cel from the series (preferably Gatch, but any will do!). Maybe someday, if the extra $$ ever presented itself to me! 
__________________
Hinotori
Eagle in Charge
Posted by gatchgirl on 06-06-2009 at 23:34:
My B/H keeps telling me it's film... I just never imprint into my mind.
__________________
" No gratitude needs to be voiced, your mind speaks to us!"
Racer by day, Feather Thrower all the time!
Posted by tatsunokofan on 07-06-2009 at 00:18:
Hi all!
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That's because they all possess a special filter that changes everything into "Do as you want, not what I say."
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For many, many years, getting a first series cel was one of those Holy Grail items for me, and it took until the late 1990s to finally track one down. Thankfully, I've found a decent selection of them since then. Second and third series cels are definitely easier to find, mostly because Tatsunoko had a system set up to sell their old cels by the time those series were airing, something they didn't have when the first series aired.
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When compared directly, the two are unmistakably different. Here is a cel:
And here is a film strip:
Probably part of what has added to the confusion you have had between the two is the annoying fact that, over the last 15 years or so, numerous manufacturers have sold film strips from popular science fiction movies in nice display cases, and have usually referred to them as cels. Yes, they're made of celluloid, but they're not cels!
James
Posted by clouddancer on 07-06-2009 at 01:46:
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LOL
I am going to have to remember that one and mention it to my Principal. He has probably heard that before but it is always good to have reminders - especially these last few days of school where we could do with a laugh because the kids are getting so "high" with thoughts of summer break.
__________________
Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.
Posted by gatchgirl on 07-06-2009 at 13:19:
Yes, mine is def. a film strip, though I like the subject on your slightly better. 
__________________
" No gratitude needs to be voiced, your mind speaks to us!"
Racer by day, Feather Thrower all the time!
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