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Posted by SJ_SwanJun on 21-12-2007 at 13:52:

I Need some Mommy Advice

Hi peeps ...

I have a little problem.

I need advice.

My little fella - the Condor - has begun swearing.

Now I don't mean the turret's-style random words. I mean the well placed, perfectly in context full on swear phrases.

His favourite right now is

"Fuck you!"

Yeah. I kid you not. I'm bloody mortified.

He said it to a work-buddy of mine when she told him to put his hat on because it was cold. Sure as shit, the kid pouted and said: "No! Fuck you!"

And last night - he dropped it on his grandmother!

Now. Flash and I simply don't talk that way (verbally anyway. When I'm online I'm a potty mouth, but he can't read that well just yet). We know he didn't get it from either of us. He only watches Treehouse on TV, so he sure as shit ain't getting it from there.

I questioned Daycare, yet they assure me that none of the kids there speak like that.

...Well not when an adult can hear them I'll bet...

So what do I do?

Flash and I have resorted to mild corporal punishment when he says it, but it is simply not working. If I chide him for it, he just gets defiant and says it more.

What can I do?

Help.

Any advice?

SJ

__________________

Sighhh

Why do men snore when lying on their backs?
Because their balls fall over their butt holes and they vapour lock.

Posted by Transmute Jun on 21-12-2007 at 15:01:

The question is, where did he learn it?

In my case, my kids learned those kind of words (my son was 3 at the time) from watching Gatchaman. I knew that was the source, and I remember bathing him one day and 'damn' and 'hell' came out every third word.

So I sat both of my kids down and explained that these were naughty words, and it was naughty to say them. And even if otherwise cool people (like Condor Joe) said them, they were still naughty. After all, EVERYONE is naughty sometimes, even Condor Joe. Big Grin

My daughter, who was 5, picked this up pretty quickly, and stopped. My son, who was 3, did not, and he kept saying these words. despite warnings. So one day I let his sister watch Gatchaman, while he was locked in the upstairs behind a child gate. He could HEAR the show, but not see it. It drove him crazy, and I told him that if he couldn't stop saying naughty words, he wouldn't be allowed to watch Gatchaman anymore.

Well, it worked, and although occasionally something will come out now (he just turned 5) a reminder is enough to stop him.

In your case, if it's not movies that he's picking it up from, I would punish him another way where it hurts. Boys who say naughty words can't play with ??? toy. Boys who say naughty words can't have cookies after dinner. Whatever works for him.

Also, Christmas is coming, and we know what Santa does to naughty boys and girls, right?

Anyhow... that's what worked for me.

__________________

Posted by SJ_SwanJun on 21-12-2007 at 15:03:

Thanks TJ - I will try that for sure.

And, yes ... Christmas is a great threat ...

Thanks again

__________________

Sighhh

Why do men snore when lying on their backs?
Because their balls fall over their butt holes and they vapour lock.

Posted by katsesama on 21-12-2007 at 21:45:

This is going to seem completely backwards, but my bet is that he isn't increasing how often he says it out of defiance -- you may be accidentally reinforcing it by reacting so strongly. In other words, the child has realized that his swearing gets him LOTS of attention from Mommy, Daddy, and everyone else as well!

So maybe very calm punishment, like what TJ said above (great story, btw!!) would be a great approach.

I'll tell you a funny story to maybe make you feel a little better. I have a friend, and he and his wife (who are both psychologists -- she's even Catholic) do swear around their kids. Their son never did it, but their daughter, who's about 4, has picked it up just fine. So after Mass one day my friend is talking to the priest, and the child drops her toy and yells, "Goddammit!"

The priest says "WHAT did she say?"

My friend says, "Uh...'I dropped it!'"

Kid yells, "No, I said goddammit !"

You might try How to Talk So Kids Will Listen, which is my favorite parenting book. It has a very mild Christian slant, but if you don't mind that (or can stand it), it's worth the $10 or whatever it costs.

Let us know what happens!

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Posted by Firebird on 24-12-2007 at 11:44:

Have to admit I did the stopping watching something he liked with my son to stop him swearing.

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Posted by CricketBeautiful on 10-01-2008 at 19:42:

I agree with Katsesama on the negative reinforcement. Negative emotions like excited parents, or fear of being spanked, or guilt can be more addictive than the good ones. (At least so says Driven To Distraction, a book on ADHD which is apparently out of date, but I found very useful.)

Your little guy is the right age to start 1-2-3 Magic. Most of the objections to that book come from the people who didn't read the entire thing. There's also a video, but I didn't see it.

How to Talk so Kids Will Listen didn't keep my interest long enough to finish reading properly, but the cartoons had a good way of looking at things, so it's still on my shelf.

IMHO, at his age the result should be immediate; by the time cookies are out, he's forgotten what he did. Kids really do live in the moment. Yes, you'll spend some time missing things yourself, but once he gets the idea, he won't test it too often. (Too often being a relative term.)

My kids know that "But Joe does it!" is pretty much irrelevant. So is "But Sosai lets me do it." What matters is that I do not let them do it. Now that they're older, they also know the reasons (and the eldest may secretly agree with them). There are lots of things other people can and can't do, like drive a car, cook, climb a ladder, or wear diapers or have all 2478 Transformer toys.

Having said that, it's still a good idea to find out who is modeling that sort of language. It's easier to behave as Mommy wants if he doesn't have as many options to try out. I remember when my son first sang a song I wasn't around when he learned; it was a perfectly normal song, learned at playschool, but it really shook me that someone else was having that large an influence on him.

__________________
Between stimulus and response there is a space.
In that space is our power to choose our response.
In our response lies our growth and our freedom.

- Viktor E. Frankl

Posted by Ebonyswanne on 10-01-2008 at 22:52:

There has to be a source for him to have heard it SJ because he seems to understand that its a word you use even if he doesn't know its full meaning. But he's doing it when he's mad at you...maybe he saw a kid or and adult in passing say it out of anger, that might be why you can't find the source.

TJ's method does work with active children. I've seen her in action, and those two kids listen because they know she means it if they get out of line and it is still done with love. Wink1

My friends do basically the same, they try not to make a big deal of it, they find the source if they can, then work out a way to show the child that it isn't appropriate language...

I've seen parents swear at their children using that kind of language(Fu8@ shut up! etc) and then smack the kids hard when they use it back...thats the only time I get ticked off with a parent about swearing. I have no sympathy for the mother/father in that situation. I used to hear it all the time working in a shopping centre, so he could have overheard something like that.

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Every child is an artist. The problem is how to remain an artist once we grow up- Pablo Picasso.